1 00:00:01,733 --> 00:00:08,332 IV: And so you left your, your home town in spring or summer '44. 2 00:00:08,333 --> 00:00:08,799 Is it not so? 3 00:00:08,800 --> 00:00:10,132 May, you could not remember exactly, but. 4 00:00:10,133 --> 00:00:21,166 EF: Eh yeah, eh, eh, yeah it, it, it, it was probably earlier. 5 00:00:21,167 --> 00:00:31,666 I think eh, I think we left the ghetto on that transport in June. 6 00:00:31,667 --> 00:00:33,332 IV: In June. 7 00:00:33,333 --> 00:00:42,999 EF: So, and we were maybe as long as a couple of months in the ghetto, I.. 8 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:45,166 More, I think more than a month. 9 00:00:45,167 --> 00:00:46,666 IV: More than a month. So.. 10 00:00:46,667 --> 00:00:52,999 EF: So that means we would have been taken probably in April or some time. 11 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,666 IV: And so it means you spent.. 12 00:00:55,667 --> 00:00:57,666 EF: '40, '44. 13 00:00:57,667 --> 00:01:01,466 IV: Nearly a year in all those camps, in lots, a lot of camps. 14 00:01:01,467 --> 00:01:02,732 EF: Y.., yes, let us see. 15 00:01:02,733 --> 00:01:06,832 IV: Yeah, maybe, 10 months or 9 or something. 16 00:01:06,833 --> 00:01:09,832 Yeah ma.., well it could have been May. 17 00:01:09,833 --> 00:01:11,332 Let us see, if it was May. 18 00:01:11,333 --> 00:01:11,999 IV: May.. 19 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:14,099 EF: Eh '44. 20 00:01:14,100 --> 00:01:14,699 IV: Yeah. 21 00:01:14,700 --> 00:01:15,666 EF: When we were transported. 22 00:01:15,667 --> 00:01:18,332 IV: Yeah, so.. 23 00:01:18,333 --> 00:01:20,999 EF: Eh and liberated in April.. 24 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:21,666 IV: So nearly.. 25 00:01:21,667 --> 00:01:25,066 EF: 23rd, nearly a year total, yeah. 26 00:01:25,067 --> 00:01:36,166 IV: So in, in all this time, what do you think, what was the most difficult, most hard and most terrible thing for you? 27 00:01:36,167 --> 00:01:44,132 EF: {breathing} Eh {breathing} you know {laughing} it is, you know it is hard to say. 28 00:01:44,133 --> 00:01:59,332 {breathing} Eh I mean one of, one of the, one of the things I remember before we were deported, for about a year at least living in just total anxiety. 29 00:01:59,333 --> 00:02:07,666 You know the fear when, because we were hearing things of what was happening in Poland and Czechoslovakia with the Jews. 30 00:02:07,667 --> 00:02:12,832 So we knew eh that something was happening. 31 00:02:12,833 --> 00:02:21,399 And I just remember this kind of general fear and anxiety for, for a long time. 32 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:45,866 {breathing} Eh {breathing} well you know, {breathing} it is hard, you know, once, once we were into labour camp and you know we were in a kind of a routine. 33 00:02:45,867 --> 00:02:51,299 Then it was simply a matter of survival, you know. 34 00:02:51,300 --> 00:02:52,999 You try not to get sick. 35 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:56,666 Because you knew, if somebody got sick they never {shaking the head} came back. 36 00:02:56,667 --> 00:03:04,666 Eh you try not to get in, not to make any problems or.. 37 00:03:04,667 --> 00:03:14,799 Because you knew that eh, eh an SS man, if he felt like it, could just shoot you and nobody would object {laughing}. 38 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:18,166 So you got simply trying to survive. 39 00:03:18,167 --> 00:03:23,166 {moving the shoulders} As best you could trying to stay healthy. 40 00:03:23,167 --> 00:03:27,666 Trying to stay psychologically healthy. 41 00:03:27,667 --> 00:03:35,832 Eh, eh but so I would say the worst part was eh both before. 42 00:03:35,833 --> 00:03:45,999 Eh leaving the village you know being marched like to the village and the villagers just look and go on. 43 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:53,899 Eh I mean, that was {shaking his head and body} wha {shivering} {laughing}. 44 00:03:53,900 --> 00:04:01,032 Eh it was something very, very strange in a way. 45 00:04:01,033 --> 00:04:09,666 {breathing} And then eh getting to Birkenau and, and eh the separation. 46 00:04:09,667 --> 00:04:14,099 And we sort of knew what was going on in Birkenau, you know. 47 00:04:14,100 --> 00:04:19,299 Eh in fact you, you could smell the crematorium already. 48 00:04:19,300 --> 00:04:34,332 And just eh, just it was so, such a, such a dark time eh that it is very difficult to describe really. 49 00:04:34,333 --> 00:04:42,332 Eh {shaking his head} it was eh something you could absolutely not imagine. 50 00:04:42,333 --> 00:04:44,532 I could not. 51 00:04:44,533 --> 00:04:56,999 But once we were sort of off to the labour camp, eh like I said, then it was more {moving his shoulders, head and body} I do not know, a certain acceptance. 52 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:01,332 And then you think you want to survive. 53 00:05:01,333 --> 00:05:18,932 Because I, I, I, I should say eh and it is obvious that eh Hungarian Jews in this respect were, were eh {breathing} were lucky, because eh the deportation did not happen until 1944 the last, last year of the war. 54 00:05:18,933 --> 00:05:34,666 And eh I mean, it, it was pretty clear to us that if this had gone on much longer we would, we would not eh survive. 55 00:05:34,667 --> 00:05:48,332 In fact I, I do not know how some of the Polish and other people maybe German and Czech who were in camps long.., much longer than we were. 56 00:05:48,333 --> 00:05:51,866 And they still survived, but.. 57 00:05:51,867 --> 00:06:03,832 I think the way things were going at, at Buna, you know the way we were being fed and worked {shaking his head and shoulders} eh you would not.. 58 00:06:03,833 --> 00:06:09,632 The end of the war came in time {confirming with head} yeah, let us put it that way. 59 00:06:09,633 --> 00:06:10,466 IV: And now... 60 00:06:10,467 --> 00:06:10,666 EF: Yeah {breathing}.. 61 00:06:10,667 --> 00:06:17,666 IV: 63 years later, what is the reason why do you came back now to Germany? 62 00:06:17,667 --> 00:06:31,332 EF: {breathing} Well, you know I, I, I have thought of eh, of eh coming back eh just, just, just for a visit eh sometime. 63 00:06:31,333 --> 00:06:41,899 But you know I, I have not really thought of Flossenbürg, because we were such a relati.., I mean compared to, to Buna, we were such a very short time in Flossenbürg. 64 00:06:41,900 --> 00:06:58,399 And I had eh, I had not, I had thought maybe I would want to go back to Birkenau, Auschwitz just to see, see the place and maybe some kind of commemoration for, for, for my family you know. 65 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:01,299 But I have not thought of Flossenbürg. 66 00:07:01,300 --> 00:07:04,499 I mean it was just a place that we stayed. 67 00:07:04,500 --> 00:07:12,166 But eh so it was really Anna Andlauer's doing that I am here. 68 00:07:12,167 --> 00:07:23,332 {laughing} {moving his head, shoulders and body} Eh and, and this is, I, I did not know it was a Flossenbürg memorial thing. 69 00:07:23,333 --> 00:07:27,966 {laughing} I had no idea until she, she told us about it. 70 00:07:27,967 --> 00:07:36,666 {moving his shoulders} {breathing} But I, I am glad eh both, from the point of view of seeing what is being done. 71 00:07:36,667 --> 00:07:50,999 And from, from the point of view of eh getting together with some of the people that we were {breathing} in Indersdorf in and some even going back to the camps. 72 00:07:51,000 --> 00:08:06,499 Eh which is eh just a you know, in a way that, in a way that times after liberation were kind of good times, you know. 73 00:08:06,500 --> 00:08:10,166 Even though, because we knew our family was gone. 74 00:08:10,167 --> 00:08:14,666 We are maybe, we, we, we did not have any hope that we will find anybody. 75 00:08:14,667 --> 00:08:17,666 Although we sp.., we were looking for a while. 76 00:08:17,667 --> 00:08:24,666 But eh in a way it was, it was a hopeful period. 77 00:08:24,667 --> 00:08:28,932 Eh we knew that eh we were going some place. 78 00:08:28,933 --> 00:08:31,566 We were leaving Germany {laughing} {moving his shoulders and body}. 79 00:08:31,567 --> 00:08:38,332 Eh and eh starting some kind of new life. 80 00:08:38,333 --> 00:08:49,332 Of course the, the fact that we had the relatives in New York was also helpful, because eh it was some, some family, you know. 81 00:08:49,333 --> 00:09:01,999 But eh if, if Anna had not been doing what she was doing I, I would not even know about Flossen.. 82 00:09:02,000 --> 00:09:02,332 IV: Yeah. 83 00:09:02,333 --> 00:09:04,999 EF: That Flossenbürg.. 84 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:09,099 Apparently there was a lot more going on here than, than I knew {laughing}. 85 00:09:09,100 --> 00:09:09,666 IV: Yeah. Yeah. 86 00:09:09,667 --> 00:09:20,166 EF: When I, it was one of apparently some kind of major camp which to us it was just a sort of a transit point. 87 00:09:20,167 --> 00:09:22,332 IV: Yeah. 88 00:09:22,333 --> 00:09:31,999 EF: Eh and eh we, we found out after liberation that we, we were on the way to Dachau. 89 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:38,666 We did not, we did not eh know that of course. 90 00:09:38,667 --> 00:09:51,332 And eh we go.., we always thou.., of course we, I, I do not know that we ever completely lost hope of being {moving head and body} somehow {laughing} saved. 91 00:09:51,333 --> 00:10:05,999 But we really felt that, that eh German eh you know the SS, the Nazis that they would not let us survive, because they would not want eh witnesses. 92 00:10:06,000 --> 00:10:07,666 IV: ..want any witnesses. 93 00:10:07,667 --> 00:10:15,999 EF: I always thought, well they, they just would not. But at the same time we did not completely eh loose hope that it might happen. 94 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:17,832 It is kind of strange, yeah. 95 00:10:17,833 --> 00:10:34,332 But eh ne..,near the end I think some, some of the.. Actually this is what, what I heard was that eh, eh.. 96 00:10:34,333 --> 00:10:50,332 Many people were saved, because eh some of the soldiers even SS thought that eh obviously the war ist lost and the Americans or whoever is coming and they try, they actually saved some people and thought this would save them.. 97 00:10:50,333 --> 00:10:50,332 IV: Save them.. 98 00:10:50,333 --> 00:10:52,666 EF: From this. 99 00:10:52,667 --> 00:11:10,899 But eh when we were liberated it was simply a matter of going one way and I, I assume eh, I that those Germans who were guarding us were, were probably became prisoners, but I do not know. 100 00:11:10,900 --> 00:11:19,832 It was, it was really an active war situation, because the war was not over yet {laughing}. 101 00:11:19,833 --> 00:11:22,366 But it was over for us {laughing}. 102 00:11:22,367 --> 00:11:22,999 That was.. 103 00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:23,666 IV: Sort of it. 104 00:11:23,667 --> 00:11:25,766 EF: That was {laughing}. 105 00:11:25,767 --> 00:11:29,000 IV: OK.